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Embers Adrift will this game Survive?

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  • QuizzicalQuizzical Member LegendaryPosts: 24,851
    Mendel said:
    achesoma said:
    Mendel said:
    Brainy said:
    I think this game should probably look to release on steam get some quick money before its feedback goes to negative.  Then sell off to one of the companies that is buying up all the MMO's.

    It might want to change its sub model to a F2P with optional sub.  

    A lot of people in Alpha/Beta were saying they thought this game would easily have 10k+ subs.  Well that didn't happen, I knew it wouldn't happen, but this is even worse than I thought.  Now they are in a huge hole, I wonder if they can dig out.

    From what I have seen of gameplay videos, no way was this game going to have 10K plus subs.....It will definitely be free at some point in the near future, and the steam suggestion is a good idea for where they will be in no time.

    There are probably more than 10k people (possibly more than 100k) looking for a game exactly like Embers or other 'Old School' games.  But those people are busy doing something else, and whatever they are doing now is their current focus.  For a new project like Embers to succeed, it will need to entice people to leave their current focus and come to it.  That's a lot of marketing, and that's the part these 'Old School' revival projects seem to forget.  Companies relying on the 1st gen MMORPG gamer have to attract those players from the remnants of the 1st gen games they are still playing.

    It's a tough ask to convince veterans from EQ1/2, UO, Runescape, etc. to abandon their decades old character to start over with a new, unpolished game.




    I believe this to be true. There is absolutely a target audience for this type of game. A vast majority of the players I met came straight from P99. Hard to convince more to come to a game with only human race, essentially 3 classes with 3 specs, and no magic. Also, the world is very small.

    This is where having a big name like Cohh interested in your game is such a significant factor. He plays small indie RPG projects like this all the time and could easily boost those numbers to the 10k range, at least temporarily.

    Possibly.  I'm not entirely convinced of the value or effectiveness of using streamers to advertise a product.  Then again, I'm not in that generation.  It does seem like a very narrow marketing focus, and I'm not certain that EQ1 veterans watch streamers.  If their target market is EQ1 vets, they seem to be missing the mark.

    Maybe Embers can find a new, younger audience in people born after 2000, but I'm guessing not.  It doesn't have the graphics precision, artwork, or innovative game play that would position it to do that.  My guess is: Embers is what it is; it won't gain a sudden influx of players unless there is significantly more development.
    Paying streamers to play your game is a fine way to market your game to gamers who watch streamers a lot.  But that's a subset of all gamers, and not necessarily even that large of a subset.  It also wouldn't surprise me if gamers who watch streamers a lot are disproportionately likely to move on quickly from a game.
    MendelAlBQuirkyBrainy
  • OG_SolareusOG_Solareus Member UncommonPosts: 332
    good video , didn't know it used to be Saga of Lucimia



    AlBQuirky
  • MendelMendel Member LegendaryPosts: 5,511
    Brainy said:
    lahnmir said:
    I didn’t say they deserve a pass, I am however saying that nowhere did they raise false expectations or hype. On the contrary, they have had a very modest approach with modest targets. So they might not meet certain standards but they definitely didn’t promise them. It is an amateur project with a regular price tag, it is up to the consumer to accept that or not. Calling it a scam or one step above Dreamworld is quite nonsensical and I would like to believe that that is your disappointment speaking. I too think the end result is lackluster but I really wasn’t promised anything else. This in stark contrast to games like Crowfall and Camelot Unchained, neither of which is much better then this if at all.

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir

    I am not saying people have a legal argument here.  Who cares whether they said this or not.  When a customer buys a product they expect it to actually function properly.  What, now customers have to read through hundreds of forum pages to get an accurate assessment of a product before they buy?

    Do you do this to everything you buy at the store?

    Next time you buy a toaster then you later find out it doesn't actually turn your bread into toast, do you expect people to come and white knight for the company saying, well on page 582 of the manual on the website they don't actually say it is going to work.  Who has this kind of time and does this kind of research?

    If you produce a game, and sell it at full price, you expect it to actually be complete not 20% of the content.  That's a bare minimum.  Additionally you expect it to be on par with similarly priced items.  I don't see why a customer shouldn't expect this.

    Until players clamp down on their wallets and stop paying for unfinished, incomplete, early access, or crowdfunded products, this trend will continue.  Customers have rights, but they also have to control their own impulses.



    BrainyKylerandragonlee66RemaliAlBQuirkyDarkZorvanReturnsDeathkon1

    Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.

  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 41,526
    Brainy said:
    lahnmir said:
    I didn’t say they deserve a pass, I am however saying that nowhere did they raise false expectations or hype. On the contrary, they have had a very modest approach with modest targets. So they might not meet certain standards but they definitely didn’t promise them. It is an amateur project with a regular price tag, it is up to the consumer to accept that or not. Calling it a scam or one step above Dreamworld is quite nonsensical and I would like to believe that that is your disappointment speaking. I too think the end result is lackluster but I really wasn’t promised anything else. This in stark contrast to games like Crowfall and Camelot Unchained, neither of which is much better then this if at all.

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir

    I am not saying people have a legal argument here.  Who cares whether they said this or not.  When a customer buys a product they expect it to actually function properly.  What, now customers have to read through hundreds of forum pages to get an accurate assessment of a product before they buy?

    Do you do this to everything you buy at the store?

    Next time you buy a toaster then you later find out it doesn't actually turn your bread into toast, do you expect people to come and white knight for the company saying, well on page 582 of the manual on the website they don't actually say it is going to work.  Who has this kind of time and does this kind of research?

    If you produce a game, and sell it at full price, you expect it to actually be complete not 20% of the content.  That's a bare minimum.  Additionally you expect it to be on par with similarly priced items.  I don't see why a customer shouldn't expect this.
    Actually I do research the products I buy, at least the top end ones like laptops or TV's.

    Small appliance not quite as much, still did it for an air fryer recently.

    Besides, I buy from retailers who have clear refund policies, were a store to say no refunds I'd be a lot more wary.

    I'm guessing most gamers do at least a modicum of research before they buy a new game, especially a relatively unknown title like Embers.

    If not, they deserve what they get, buyer beware and all.


    AlBQuirky

    "True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde 

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

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    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • QbertqQbertq Member UncommonPosts: 399
    If it's not on steam, then it's really missing out on a lot of potential business.   I prefer steam and only go for a game not on steam unless it really interests me.  I despise all these companies that come up with their own launchers.

    Some companies have the clout to do it.  I despise them for doing it, but sometimes, you go where there is some water to drink.  A small project like this, while enormous to them, is a small project in MMO'verse.

    I think it's crazy to think that they aren't looking at steam very hard right now.  It doesn't mean the game is good, it's simple exposure and reach.

    I wish them luck 
    AlBQuirkyBrainyDeathkon1
  • KnightFalzKnightFalz Member EpicPosts: 3,495
    lahnmir said:
    Embers Adrift is a hobby project built by amateurs in their spare time, it always has been. The idea that they are a “real” company with financial targets and all of that just isn’t applicable here. Whether all of it is any good is up for debate but they did exactly what they wanted to do and actually have more of a product then a veteran like Marc Jacobs does with his real company. They made a game and released it, everything else is icing on the cake, even being a (modest) success.

    Will it survive? Probably not. Is it worse then every professional product out there? Definitely not.

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir
    99.9% of their game is assets from the Unity shop. It's an asset flip at it's core. But *someday* they're going to hire an artist!! 

    That purchased assets were used is not an issue.considering their resources available. What can be is what they chose to do with them.
    AlBQuirkyKylerancheyaneSovrath
  • KnightFalzKnightFalz Member EpicPosts: 3,495
    Brainy said:
    lahnmir said:
    I didn’t say they deserve a pass, I am however saying that nowhere did they raise false expectations or hype. On the contrary, they have had a very modest approach with modest targets. So they might not meet certain standards but they definitely didn’t promise them. It is an amateur project with a regular price tag, it is up to the consumer to accept that or not. Calling it a scam or one step above Dreamworld is quite nonsensical and I would like to believe that that is your disappointment speaking. I too think the end result is lackluster but I really wasn’t promised anything else. This in stark contrast to games like Crowfall and Camelot Unchained, neither of which is much better then this if at all.

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir

    I am not saying people have a legal argument here.  Who cares whether they said this or not.  When a customer buys a product they expect it to actually function properly.  What, now customers have to read through hundreds of forum pages to get an accurate assessment of a product before they buy?

    Do you do this to everything you buy at the store?

    Next time you buy a toaster then you later find out it doesn't actually turn your bread into toast, do you expect people to come and white knight for the company saying, well on page 582 of the manual on the website they don't actually say it is going to work.  Who has this kind of time and does this kind of research?

    If you produce a game, and sell it at full price, you expect it to actually be complete not 20% of the content.  That's a bare minimum.  Additionally you expect it to be on par with similarly priced items.  I don't see why a customer shouldn't expect this.

    The game does function properly, or at least did the last time I played it. Whether those functions are proper is debatable.

    Customers don't need to read anything when they purchase a product. It is increasingly prudent to do so the more costly it is for the person considering purchase.

    I don't expect MMORPGs to be complete when I purchase them as it is contrary to their nature. Having more content available at launch is better than less generally but that isn't the only relevant factor.

    I expect the value I perceive in a game to be at least on par with that I perceive in other similar games that I could instead play.
    AlBQuirkyBrainy
  • AlBQuirkyAlBQuirky Member EpicPosts: 7,388
    edited November 2022
    Brainy said:
    What is with this touchy feely stuff where now its based on "who" made it. Shouldn't it be judged on the product itself like quality, entertainment value and price?


    Well... I'd not judge a 5 year old's picture in the same vein of a Rembrandt. For me, I'll cut some slack because they are at least trying in a vein that appeals to me.

    I do get your point about "professionalism", though. They have released the game and are charging "real money" for it. That's not too far off from any "big company" charging for beta tests.

    These developers don't get "a pass" from me, but they also don't get my "claws out" response that I could give :)

    PS: I have not played this game, nor seen anything about it, so take my opinion as it is :)
    BrainySovrath

    - Al

    Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse.
    - FARGIN_WAR


  • DarkZorvanReturnsDarkZorvanReturns Member RarePosts: 654
    Qbertq said:
    If it's not on steam, then it's really missing out on a lot of potential business.   I prefer steam and only go for a game not on steam unless it really interests me.  I despise all these companies that come up with their own launchers.

    Some companies have the clout to do it.  I despise them for doing it, but sometimes, you go where there is some water to drink.  A small project like this, while enormous to them, is a small project in MMO'verse.

    I think it's crazy to think that they aren't looking at steam very hard right now.  It doesn't mean the game is good, it's simple exposure and reach.

    I wish them luck 
    They won't, because Steam allows refunds.
    BrainyAlBQuirky
  • BrainyBrainy Member EpicPosts: 1,482
    AlBQuirky said:

    Well... I'd not judge a 5 year old's picture in the same vein of a Rembrandt. For me, I'll cut some slack because they are at least trying in a vein that appeals to me.
    Why not?  Rembrandt was 5 years old at one point right?

    I get that if you buy an investment, you have to value its worth (to everyone else) in order to understand if its worth it to buy it.  You could absolutely hate something, but if you are getting an 80% discount on it, it might be worth buying it to resale later.

    AlBQuirky said:

    I do get your point about "professionalism", though. They have released the game and are charging "real money" for it. That's not too far off from any "big company" charging for beta tests.

    These developers don't get "a pass" from me, but they also don't get my "claws out" response that I could give :)

    PS: I have not played this game, nor seen anything about it, so take my opinion as it is :)

    If you are buying a game shouldn't it be based on the value to you personally and not others?  Games you invest your time into, I don't see them as long term resale investments.

    But here is where I see a big problem.  So lets say you review a game right?  Normally you would give it a 5, but because its made by 2 person team you rate it 8?  If you find out the lead is an orphan, you bump it to a 9?

    If you really like a game say a solid 9, but its made by a big company you subtract a point to an 8?  What happens if its published by a mega company, but was actually made by a small team?  Extra points or call it even?

    This way of rating is absolutely ridiculous to me.  I cant even comprehend what possible outside factors people could be using to rate something.  I am not saying you are rating things in this way.

    However anyone that rates using things that are not concrete to the value of the game as an entertainment product is completely meaningless to me.

    Price, Quality, Entertainment Value (to me) is what should be used to judge a game.  I don't care if a guy down the street wrote it, or a homeless person wrote it, or any other special circumstance.







    RemaliAlBQuirky
  • lahnmirlahnmir Member LegendaryPosts: 4,938

    But here is where I see a big problem.  So lets say you review a game right?  Normally you would give it a 5, but because its made by 2 person team you rate it 8?  If you find out the lead is an orphan, you bump it to a 9?

    If you really like a game say a solid 9, but its made by a big company you subtract a point to an 8?  What happens if its published by a mega company, but was actually made by a small team?  Extra points or call it even?

    This way of rating is absolutely ridiculous to me.  I cant even comprehend what possible outside factors people could be using to rate something.  I am not saying you are rating things in this way.

    However anyone that rates using things that are not concrete to the value of the game as an entertainment product is completely meaningless to me.

    Price, Quality, Entertainment Value (to me) is what should be used to judge a game.  I don't care if a guy down the street wrote it, or a homeless person wrote it, or any other special circumstance.







    Completely understandable but this is mostly about expectations and who set them. In this case the company didn’t set any, the customer did. A company should do A/B/C because I expect X/Y/Z is a perfectly fine line of thought but isn’t in any way set by the company in question. 

    And even though the product might be inferior people are cutting them slack because this space is full of companies promising everything and the kitchen sink in the most glorious package ever and never deliver, this company didn’t do any of that. A niche game targeted (very modestly) at a niche audience without any pretense, I appreciate that, even when the results aren’t that good. Some things are about intent and not about bang for buck, at least to me they are.

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir
    BrainyKyleranAlBQuirky
    'the only way he could nail it any better is if he used a cross.'

    Kyleran on yours sincerely 


    'But there are many. You can play them entirely solo, and even offline. Also, you are wrong by default.'

    Ikcin in response to yours sincerely debating whether or not single-player offline MMOs exist...



    'This does not apply just to ED but SC or any other game. What they will get is Rebirth/X4, likely prettier but equally underwhelming and pointless. 

    It is incredibly difficult to design some meaningfull leg content that would fit a space ship game - simply because it is not a leg game.

    It is just huge resource waste....'

    Gdemami absolutely not being an armchair developer

  • cheyanecheyane Member LegendaryPosts: 8,671
    I have to admit that they have been upfront about the dearth of content . It was quite apparent to me when I tested it and why I did not buy it.

    It is not like I'm giving it a passing grade but merely toning my expectations down and deciding what I want from a game like that. Of course having played Everquest I am quite unable to accept anything that at least does not match that game in some respects like spells, skills and dungeon diversity being the most obvious ones.

    I don't want to bash this game and I know my standards are impossible in reality because of who were at the helm of that game.
    BrainyAlBQuirky
    Chamber of Chains
  • BrainyBrainy Member EpicPosts: 1,482
    cheyane said:

    I don't want to bash this game and I know my standards are impossible in reality because of who were at the helm of that game.

    Why do you think your standards are impossible just because you expect a current 2022 game to be as good as a 1999 game?

    What a world we live in where we have to apologize for expecting a current game to be as good or better than a 20 year old game.

    I don't think EQ lead was some one of a kind genius of his time.  UO, EQ, DAOC, WoW, SWG all did it back then.

    The industry changed, they cannot seem to replicate the quality of old games.  Those old games had so much more depth than some of the clones like Embers has now.

    Embers vs any of those old games, there is just no comparison really.  Its like comparing a paper airplane, to a real military jet fighter.  There might be some resemblance there, but its just not even close to the same complexity.
    RemaliMendelAlBQuirky
  • Deathkon1Deathkon1 Member RarePosts: 822
    It might survive but thats different then thriving.
    BrainyAlBQuirky
    Favorite book way of the devil
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  • Deathkon1Deathkon1 Member RarePosts: 822
    edited November 2022
    Brainy said:
    I think this game should probably look to release on steam get some quick money before its feedback goes to negative.  Then sell off to one of the companies that is buying up all the MMO's.

    It might want to change its sub model to a F2P with optional sub.  

    A lot of people in Alpha/Beta were saying they thought this game would easily have 10k+ subs.  Well that didn't happen, I knew it wouldn't happen, but this is even worse than I thought.  Now they are in a huge hole, I wonder if they can dig out.
    The issue is the moment games have a monthly fee right off the bat and its brand new that scares alot of people from trying it especially when its not even fully fleshed out.
    Post edited by Deathkon1 on
    BrainyAlBQuirky
    Favorite book way of the devil
    https://bit.ly/3DcHgqm
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    https://bit.ly/3Rw5txY
  • Deathkon1Deathkon1 Member RarePosts: 822
    Qbertq said:
    If it's not on steam, then it's really missing out on a lot of potential business.   I prefer steam and only go for a game not on steam unless it really interests me.  I despise all these companies that come up with their own launchers.

    Some companies have the clout to do it.  I despise them for doing it, but sometimes, you go where there is some water to drink.  A small project like this, while enormous to them, is a small project in MMO'verse.

    I think it's crazy to think that they aren't looking at steam very hard right now.  It doesn't mean the game is good, it's simple exposure and reach.

    I wish them luck 
    I find them not being on steam flat out stupid with how easy it is to get approved on it.
    BrainyAlBQuirky
    Favorite book way of the devil
    https://bit.ly/3DcHgqm
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  • cheyanecheyane Member LegendaryPosts: 8,671
    edited November 2022
    The reason is there is a lack of talent and funds. Nowadays games require so much more money and the talent seems to have just dissipated or focused on more mundane things like monetization and shareholders.

     Once upon a time when you go back and read the interviews of people who worked on Everquest you get the excitement and stealth they had to employ because Smedley was worried that Sony would cancel the project and yet they had more freedom and funds available if you compare the numbers with the matching inflation.

    I feel there's no chance anymore for a game like Everquest. It will be a poor representation and that goes for Pantheon too. We have games now more innovative on the ways to make money or hide tiers of monetization that just barely pass on the gameplay. Like I said the focus has changed so I am sorry for expecting too much because I honestly don't think there is an avenue for the kind of quality and game I would personally enjoy. It is further complicated by the added focus on action games and flashy combat coupled with good graphics. 

    I have honestly just given up hope. This is my own personal view and may not be any reflection on reality as others may see it.
    ScotDeathkon1MendelAlBQuirkyBrainy
    Chamber of Chains
  • BrainyBrainy Member EpicPosts: 1,482
    Qbertq said:
    If it's not on steam, then it's really missing out on a lot of potential business.   I prefer steam and only go for a game not on steam unless it really interests me.  I despise all these companies that come up with their own launchers.

    Some companies have the clout to do it.  I despise them for doing it, but sometimes, you go where there is some water to drink.  A small project like this, while enormous to them, is a small project in MMO'verse.

    I think it's crazy to think that they aren't looking at steam very hard right now.  It doesn't mean the game is good, it's simple exposure and reach.

    I wish them luck 
    They won't, because Steam allows refunds.
    I wouldn't be so certain on people being able to get refunds.

    In Embers it takes more than 2 hours to figure out the tutorial area of the zone is the best content in the game.  Its not until after you get out of the newbie zone do you start to realize, there really isn't anything more to the game.

    I think its the reviews they will need to be worried about if anything.  But even then, most people review a game with less than 5 hours of play.  Many will review positive thinking the game is only going to get better.

    So I don't think releasing to Steam would be worse than their current situation.  Which is a massive exodus of players.
    AlBQuirky
  • ScotScot Member LegendaryPosts: 19,959
    cheyane said:
    The reason is there is a lack of talent and funds. Nowadays games require so much more money and the talent seems to have just dissipated or focused on more mundane things like monetization and shareholders.

     Once upon a time when you go back and read the interviews of people who worked on Everquest you get the excitement and stealth they had to employ because Smedley was worried that Sony would cancel the project and yet they had more freedom and funds available if you compare the numbers with the matching inflation.

    I feel there's no chance anymore for a game like Everquest. It will be a poor representation and that goes for Pantheon too. We have games now more innovative on the ways to make money or hide tiers of monetization that just barely pass on the gameplay. Like I said the focus has changed so I am sorry for expecting too much because I honestly don't think there is an avenue for the kind of quality and game I would personally enjoy. It is further complicated by the added focus on action games and flashy combat coupled with good graphics. 

    I have honestly just given up hope. This is my own personal view and may not be any reflection on reality as others may see it.
    I don't think we should ever give up hope, but mine is a candle in the wind compared to what it used to be. I had my greatest hopes of MMOs going into a new era after the launch of Lotro, ESO, the start of crowd funded MMOs and launch of the classic servers. Each time the promise was not fulfilled, MMOs as a genre continue on a trajectory that it is becoming harder and harder for me to find a home in. We may find a niche home yet in a CF MMO or return to our old ones, that's the best bet I see for now.
    Deathkon1MendelAlBQuirkyBrainy
  • KnightFalzKnightFalz Member EpicPosts: 3,495
    Qbertq said:
    If it's not on steam, then it's really missing out on a lot of potential business.   I prefer steam and only go for a game not on steam unless it really interests me.  I despise all these companies that come up with their own launchers.

    Some companies have the clout to do it.  I despise them for doing it, but sometimes, you go where there is some water to drink.  A small project like this, while enormous to them, is a small project in MMO'verse.

    I think it's crazy to think that they aren't looking at steam very hard right now.  It doesn't mean the game is good, it's simple exposure and reach.

    I wish them luck 
    They won't, because Steam allows refunds.

    I don't think that's the reason. The refund window on Steam is quite short and the pace of play and advancement in Embers Adrift quite slow.

    Unless that which spurs a desire to refund is quite early on that window of opportunity is likely to have expired by the time the player wants to make use of it.
    BrainyAlBQuirky
  • GreatnessGreatness Member UncommonPosts: 2,155
    good video , didn't know it used to be Saga of Lucimia



    Probably got paid for this, he has done
     videos in past acting like he has played and then later admits to being paid. 
    AlBQuirky

    ~Greatness~

    MMORPG Blog
    Currently Playing:
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  • QbertqQbertq Member UncommonPosts: 399
    lahnmir said:
    Embers Adrift is a hobby project built by amateurs in their spare time, it always has been. The idea that they are a “real” company with financial targets and all of that just isn’t applicable here. Whether all of it is any good is up for debate but they did exactly what they wanted to do and actually have more of a product then a veteran like Marc Jacobs does with his real company. They made a game and released it, everything else is icing on the cake, even being a (modest) success.

    Will it survive? Probably not. Is it worse then every professional product out there? Definitely not.

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir
    99.9% of their game is assets from the Unity shop. It's an asset flip at it's core. But *someday* they're going to hire an artist!! 

    That purchased assets were used is not an issue.considering their resources available. What can be is what they chose to do with them.
    That's kind of the point of the Unity Shop, isn't it?
    AlBQuirky
  • DilligDillig Member UncommonPosts: 122
    Brainy said:
    Qbertq said:
    If it's not on steam, then it's really missing out on a lot of potential business.   I prefer steam and only go for a game not on steam unless it really interests me.  I despise all these companies that come up with their own launchers.

    Some companies have the clout to do it.  I despise them for doing it, but sometimes, you go where there is some water to drink.  A small project like this, while enormous to them, is a small project in MMO'verse.

    I think it's crazy to think that they aren't looking at steam very hard right now.  It doesn't mean the game is good, it's simple exposure and reach.

    I wish them luck 
    They won't, because Steam allows refunds.
    I wouldn't be so certain on people being able to get refunds.

    In Embers it takes more than 2 hours to figure out the tutorial area of the zone is the best content in the game.  Its not until after you get out of the newbie zone do you start to realize, there really isn't anything more to the game.

    I think its the reviews they will need to be worried about if anything.  But even then, most people review a game with less than 5 hours of play.  Many will review positive thinking the game is only going to get better.

    So I don't think releasing to Steam would be worse than their current situation.  Which is a massive exodus of players.
    I dont know if the game will survive for long or not. What I do know is I been playing since release have 3 characters my highest is 18 and  I am only in 3rd dungeon. still have plenty to do in the game. So you sitting her telling people that the newbie area is the best part of the game is a BS lie. CV2 was better than anything in the newbie zone. 

     I also subbed for another month. Will keep going I don't know. As far as longevity goes, the game has a huge issue right know for bringing in new people. If there are no players at the low levels they will never survive. I have notice a lack of payers at level 10-15 already as I have alts in that range. If you can get groups in those lower level ranges then the game will die. Which I still believe it will because of these short comings. 

    One more thing I will say is I have gotten my moneys worth already. I would say I have have gotten around 50 hours of game play out of the game. at 30$ plaus another 10 for the second month. anytime I can get under 2$ an hour from a game and enjoy the game I am happy as $#!t
    AlBQuirky
  • BrainyBrainy Member EpicPosts: 1,482
    Greatness said:
    Probably got paid for this, he has done
     videos in past acting like he has played and then later admits to being paid. 
    I don't know if he got paid or not.  It looks like he didn't even leave the newbie zone. Reached level 4?  If he was presented this, and knew this was the entirety of the game.  Would he still have the same opinion?

    I would like to see him get to level 25-30, then review the game LOL.  I am pretty sure it would be a different review altogether.


    GreatnessAlBQuirky
  • BrainyBrainy Member EpicPosts: 1,482
    Dillig said:
    I dont know if the game will survive for long or not. What I do know is I been playing since release have 3 characters my highest is 18 and  I am only in 3rd dungeon. still have plenty to do in the game. So you sitting her telling people that the newbie area is the best part of the game is a BS lie. CV2 was better than anything in the newbie zone. 

     I also subbed for another month. Will keep going I don't know. As far as longevity goes, the game has a huge issue right know for bringing in new people. If there are no players at the low levels they will never survive. I have notice a lack of payers at level 10-15 already as I have alts in that range. If you can get groups in those lower level ranges then the game will die. Which I still believe it will because of these short comings. 

    One more thing I will say is I have gotten my moneys worth already. I would say I have have gotten around 50 hours of game play out of the game. at 30$ plaus another 10 for the second month. anytime I can get under 2$ an hour from a game and enjoy the game I am happy as $#!t

    Well what I am saying is, there are no new game loops outside the newbie zone.  There are no new mechanics, crafting loops, skill loops, exploration loops.  So what you are doing in the newbie zone, will be what you do through this entire game.  Loot in the game is absolutely horrible worst of any MMO I have ever seen.  Your skills auto-level.  No different profession past level 6.  You will be using your newbie skills the entire game.  All the mobs you see in the newbie zone will be the same ones you see all through the game.

    In other threads, I have said this games Goldilocks levels are 5-15, which is where the most fun happens.  I have conceded in other threads this game has some fun between level 5-15 which is the 1st day of /played. After that it goes downhill fast.  By level 25, you will have a much better idea of what everyone else that played it to 25 is talking about.

    So yes, if you want to keep deleting your characters, and replaying level 5-15, then go ahead and do that, stretch the limited content the best you can.  The gameplay on different classes past 3 isn't much different, so not sure why you would want to do that but have at it.

    It takes 1 maybe 2 days max to hit level 20.  So when people judge an MMO, they usually want to know what's past the 1st day /played time.  But if you are happy with just the newbie zone, whatever floats your boat.  I think people who are deciding whether to play, should have a review that is in context.  A tutorial area review, vs the rest of the game review.

    IF you ever make it to level 30 please come back and tell us how great the game is in its CURRENT FORM please.  But that's assuming you still feel the same which I doubt you will.  I am still waiting for all the other newbie zone fanbois to do that.


    AlBQuirky
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